Greg Stafford on God’s Ignorance (Part 4): God As Man’s Prophet

Regarding the creation of mankind, the Westminster Shorter Catechism (Q10) asks “How did God create man?” And it answers the question by stating “God created man male and female, after his own image, in knowledge, righteousness, and holiness, with dominion over the creatures” (emphasis mine). And because we are made in the image of God, we are to image Him (as only man can), in all of our being. We tend to look at this section of Genesis (1-3) as man either obeying and disobeying God strictly in their ethic (how they live their lives).

But as God’s creatures, Adam and Eve were to be Yahweh’s servant with all their being. We are told that the greatest commandment is “to love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength” (emphasis mine). This commandment, although not stated in Genesis was certainly Adam greatest commandment. And just as we are not to love and serve God in our own strength, according to our own dictates, Adam, again, was no different.

It is clear from the NT that part of the image that is being restored has to do with knowledge. What we know, how do we know it, etc. One picture of the Christian, is that he is as priest, offering up to God our own bodies (including our minds) as living sacrifices, and in doing so our minds will be transformed, to know God’s will. We are told in other places that we are to “take every thought captive to the obedience of Christ” (2Cor. 10:5). In Eph. 4:22-23 Paul states “You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; to be made new in the attitude of your minds; and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.” and in Col. 3:10 Paul continues this line of reason stating “and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator.”

If one of the goals of our sanctification is that we are “think God’s thoughts after him” as Cornelius Van Til stated, we can safely assume that in the garden, prior to the fall, Adam possessed the knowledge Paul speaks about in the above verses. The difference being, that Adam before the fall did not have to “take every thought captive,” this was a given. Adam, prior to the fall, was thinking God’s thoughts after Him.

Being made in the image of God, man was to be God’s prophet, priest and king. He was to rule over creation, he was to subdue creation and he was to proclaim the works and mind of the mind of his creator to the creation. After all, if Adam failed in any of these before the actual fall, we would have a pre-fall. But we know this wasn’t the case.

When we look at the teachings of Mr. Greg Stafford, we see the roles of prophet exchanged from man being the prophet of God, to God being a prophet for man. Mr. Stafford has established for himself (with the help of Jehovah’s Witness publications) that there is knowledge God is not aware of and can not know until man reveals it. After man says what he says, it becomes revelation for God, and now God can speak forth what Adam, apart from his image-bearing, has made known. Remember, Mr. Stafford has told us that when God told Adam to name the animals, that God did not know what Adam was going to name them. God’s knowledge was limited to the free choices of man. God, now thinks man’s thoughts after him.

One important point to recognize here is that built into in Mr. Stafford’s theology, is a place for man’s autonomy. He (man) is a law unto himself. Before the fall, he can do things and say things without thinking God’s thought after him. Man, apart from God, makes decisions, which in the end, bind God and instead of man being the prophet for God, God becomes the mouth piece for man. Man becomes the final reference point and the the creator-creature distinction is blurred.

I can not say it better than Van Til at this point when he states “It is only when this point is carefully noted that the Christian and the non-Christian points of view are seen in their right relationship to one another. The two positions have mutually exclusive views of the ultimate reference point in predication” (Christian Apologetics, 2ed., 43).

[Note: The thoughts in this post are being developed for a paper I am currently writing for an apologetics class. When finished, Lord willing, I will post the paper on the blog. I am certainly open to your thoughts; positive or negative].

Greg Stafford on “Proper” Hermeneutics?

Greg Stafford recetly responded to a question on his Website. The questioner asked “How can others be assisted in getting such a relationship and improving the quality of their prayers?”

Here is Mr. Stafford’s (partial) response:

“One way you can make your Bible study experience more spiritual is by, with the Bible in your hand and with your fingers placed on the closed pages opposite the spine, first pray to Jah for guidance and ask that he direct you to that section of the Bible that contains that which he wants to you consider most of all, at this time. Then spread your fingers across the closed pages and open the Bible at a point where you feel Jah is directing you, look first at the top of the page and then at the first chapter below it, and then starting reading. Keep going until you believe you have found something that you can appreciate and learn from in a way that will directly impact your thinking and your life. Remember, the ‘word of Jah is alive’ (Hebrews 4:12), so whether Jah responds to your prayer and guides you to the pages that contain the living spirit of his word is up to him. But by putting yourself in the position to rely on him to direct you to that which contains his teachings, you are allowing him to be more involved in your spiritual life and you are developing a strong, direct link to him that will begin to transform how you think and how you study.”

Which is interesting since in post 335 Mr. Stafford makes the following comment: “I don’t think it’s appropriate, most of the time, to use experiences to justify any kind of guidance or divine intervention.” I guess in the above case, is why he qualified this statement with “most.”

Every time I have taught hermeneutics (and I know I’ve mentioned it in other contexts), I make it a point to address Mr. Stafford’s way of studying the Bible; stating that this is not the proper way to do any kind of Bible study.

If Mr. Stafford teaches this is the proper way to conduct yourself in your own privite studies, one can see how he can come to the conclusion that God is just like man, learning as he goes along.

Friends, I trust that you know this is not the proper way to study the scriptures. For further information on this topic click here.

Jehovah’s Witnesses

David Reed, author of Answering Jehovah’s Witnesses Subject by Subject was guest on Issues Etc. yesterday. The topic was “Witnessing to Jehovah’s Witnesses.” Here is the audio in two parts:

Part 1*
Part 2

*Part 1 starts about half-way through.

I haven’t had a chance to listen to the program yet.

David Reed’s website is http://www.cftf.com.

See also:

Jehovah’s Witnesses: The Claims, Doctrinal Changes and Prophetic Speculation. What Does the Record Show?. Edmond C. Gruss (Xulon Press, 2001; ISBN#: 1-9312-3230-X).

Understanding Jehovah’s Witnesses: Why They Read the Bible the Way They Do. Robert Bowman Jr. (Baker, 1991; ISBN#: 0-8010-0995-2).

The Watchtower Files. Duane Magnani (Bethany House, 1985; ISBN#: 0-8712-3816-0).

The Trinitarian God is not a “Person,” he is a “Being”?

I encountered something when I first heard JW Apologists Greg Stafford debate Robert Bowman, Jr. and I believe Greg mentioned it in his debate with James White. After I did my Countercult apologetics program with Paul Carden, I had a JW call me on the phone and state the same thing. The point being made by the JW apologist is that Trinitarians make this sharp distinction between God as a being and the three persons of the Trinity.

For some reason, these JW apologists like to tell Christians what they believe, and so one JW apologist recently stated to me “Trinitarians do not believe that the Triune God is a person..

Actually, when I heard Greg state something similar, my first thought was that Greg obviously believes he is making a strong argument against trinitarian theology, therefore a point trinitarians need to address. Many of Greg’s disciples have followed his footsteps, making similar statements.

I am interested in what other Trinitarians think about such a statement. Any thoughts?

John M. Fraiser addresses some of these issues in his paper Person and Substance: Toward an Understanding of Divine Ontology.

« Previous entries